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Called to Coach
Bringing CliftonStrengths® as a Change Agent to Lockton
Called to Coach

Bringing CliftonStrengths® as a Change Agent to Lockton

Webcast Details

  • What are some keys to embedding CliftonStrengths in an organization's culture?
  • What are some roadblocks along the way, and how can you overcome them?
  • What is strengths "pull-through," and how can that help you measure your progress?

Gallup Called to Coach Webcast Series -- Season 10, Episode 23.

Below are audio and video plus a transcript of the conversation, including time stamps.


Coaches, leaders and managers who are endeavoring to bring CliftonStrengths to their organizations often view themselves as agents of change. Yet the pace of change, and the widespread embracing of CliftonStrengths at the team and organizational levels, can be painstakingly slow. Meet Mary Rose Wild, Vice President of Talent Development at Lockton. Mary Rose has gained numerous insights on bringing strengths to an organization. These include the value of listening and persistence, and how strengths advocates can leverage their own strengths as they seek to make CliftonStrengths a part of their organization's DNA. Join us as Mary Rose shares what she has learned.


I love my talents. ... I think as champions of Gallup Strengths, those of us who are coaches adopt the words, "Guilty as charged." And I think I am guilty as charged for all of these talents and strengths, but I lean into them.

Mary Rose Wild, 3:21

One of the things about CliftonStrengths that I love is it's not just about the 34 strengths and the assessment, but it's that full mindset shift, and mindset shifts take time.

Mary Rose Wild, 19:25

Success is a change agent, and introducing Gallup Strengths is about persistence in doing so.

Mary Rose Wild, 25:15

Jim Collison 0:00
I am Jim Collison, and this is Gallup's Called to Coach, recorded on May 20, 2022.

Meet Our Guest on This Episode

Jim Collison 0:18
Called to Coach is a resource for those that want to help others discover and use their strengths. We have Gallup experts and independent strengths coaches share tactics, insights and strategies to help coaches maximize the talent of individuals, teams and organizations around the world. If you're listening live on our live page,, there's a link right above me there to our YouTube page that has the chat room. We'd love to have your questions towards the end of the program today. Or, if you're listening after the fact or listening to this as a podcast, you can always email us your questions: Don't forget to subscribe to Called to Coach on your favorite podcast app or on YouTube; hit the Subscribe button below so you never miss an episode. Mary Rose Wild is my guest today. Mary Rose is the Vice President of Talent Development at Lockton. Founded in 1966, Lockton is the world's largest privately held insurance brokerage firm. Mary Rose joined Lockton in, in 2021, bringing over 20 years of experience in corporate training, organizational effectiveness and human resources. Mary Rose is a CliftonStrengths champion, using her talents to enable a strengths philosophy throughout her new organization. Mary Rose also brings excellence, real-world perspective on best practices to consider when introducing CliftonStrengths at work. Her Top 5: Achiever, Focus, Activator, Futuristic and Relator. Mary Rose, welcome to the program!

Mary Rose Wild 1:43
Great, thank you. Thanks for having me. Excited to be here.

Jim Collison 1:46
So good to have you. Let's get to know you a little bit. I read your bio, but lots of people check out when other people read bios. Can we, can we hear it from your perspective? What do you get paid to do?

Mary Rose Wild 1:57
Yeah, absolutely. I checked in when you said my bio, especially when you said 20 years, because I sound really old when you say that. But I do have that many years of experience in all aspects of organizational development, talent management and HR. I've had the pleasure and the privilege to be able to do it on both sides of the pond. So I've spent time in Europe over several years as well. And, you know, in my current role at Lockton, you know, I really, it's sort of a reimagined role and one that I think my remit is around building strategy around our talent development and talent management programs, creating clarity for our TD network, which is our all of our associate development and talent development colleagues who operate in our divisions, which we call our series. And really just creating value for the organization, trying to meet it where it's at in terms of readiness for new things like Gallup Strengths, and marshaling sort of that change forward throughout the organization.

Jim Collison 3:03
As you think about your new role and your Top 5 and, you know, how do you think, how do you think -- because, you know, a new role is always a great opportunity to try something new in that. How do you think you'll roll your, how will you roll those talents into your new position there?

Mary Rose Wild 3:19
Yeah, that's a great question. You know, I, I love my talents. You know, we, I think as champions of Gallup Strengths, those of us who are coaches adopt the words, "Guilty as charged." And I think I am guilty as charged for all of these talents and strengths, but I lean into them. The one that I feel like I use a lot in a new role is Relator, is trying to really get to know all my, my team, my colleagues, my constituents and stakeholders, and really building deep relationships is something that's important to me. So I feel like I leverage that first and try and quiet the Activator and Achiever. It's hard to do, because I want to be in a listening mode. And I certainly was in my first 100 days, and then I asked for a second 100 days from my leadership; I said, "I need to keep listening."

Mary Rose Wild 4:10
So, so that's, that's sort of how I was sort of purposely, I think, and deliberately thinking about my strengths and leaning into some, like, and quieting others. And now that I'm about 14 months into my role, and I've built what I hope is some credibility in the organization and some strong initial relationships, I feel like now I can begin to lever the Achiever and the Focus and the drive of Activator to start getting some things done.

Bringing Strengths and a Strengths-Based Mindset to Lockton

Jim Collison 4:39
That's great. Sounds like you've got a good handle on it going forward. What made you want to bring, you know, a strengths-based mindset to Lockton?

Mary Rose Wild 4:48
Yeah, I mean, you know, I sipped the Kool-Aid of Gallup a long, long time ago, actually; this is my now fourth company with Gallup. And so I was strengths-certified over 15 years ago. And I saw -- at that time in my life, I saw the initial, I guess, potential of Gallup. And then moving to another organization that really had it embedded into its DNA over 30 years, I saw the full manifestation of what it could be. So coming into my organization, it was something that was in the back of my mind. But any new role I take on, it's not about sort of duplicating or replicating what I've done in the past, but really just, again, listening and learning the organization and seeing if there was an opportunity. And indeed there was.

Mary Rose Wild 5:41
Lockton is an organization that is very familiar with assessments; it's used a couple others for a couple of decades now, actually. And in the course of my listening to leaders and managers and our associates in the organization, they, they were appreciative of those assessments, but then also they had sort of run, run their course. And, and what they were sort of looking for -- what else? What else can help me learn and grow? And how do I deepen in this space? And I've done everything that I possibly could with that assessment; what else can we be doing? And so that prompted us to begin the conversation of bringing CliftonStrengths into Lockton.

Jim Collison 6:25
You're in a great spot, because you've -- often here on Called to Coach, we interview organizations that have been doing it for a couple, couple years, maybe 3, 4, 5 years. You did that in organizations in the past, but now you're 14 months into this journey, and all the getting started of developing a strengths-based organization is fresh in your mind. And oftentimes the question we get asked a lot by HR professionals and learning and development professionals is what kind of barriers do you come up against? And so at Lockton, it sounded like the ground was pretty fertile to begin with. But what kind of barriers did you have there?

Mary Rose Wild 7:00
Yeah, for sure. Yes, fertile and, and some readiness. But then also, I would say, some reluctance and hesitancy in different pockets of the organization. And I guess it was really seeing the playing field clearly and understanding the stakeholders clear, clearly. Leaning into those who were more org-ready for change and, and leveraging them as potential ambassadors in the organization. And then letting others sort of take their time. We knew, as an organization, Lockton's various divisions -- again, we call them series -- operate very independently with their own P&L, their own leadership teams.

Mary Rose Wild 7:41
And so the approach we're taking now is to let them sort of come to the tool and to the realization of the power of that tool and that assessment and the toolkit for themselves. Letting them go at their own pace, and let, letting that pace vary across the organization, as opposed to trying to be sort of like a one-size-fits-all approach. We're letting our 8 divisions, our 8 series, decide for themselves the pace that they would like to execute, now that we have done CliftonStrengths and Clifton coaching training for the organization. So that's really worked well for us. And indeed, we do have some stakeholders, we have one division that's put their entire division through it. And that's in the course of a short 5 months. And that's great, because they are our early ambassadors and, and they can be sort of like the proof, if you will, for others, as we continue the journey.

Jim Collison 8:41
Certainly some of the series that you're talking about are going maybe faster than others. Are you, are you seeing any best practices come out of those groups where it's working really well? What are you seeing in them?

Mary Rose Wild 8:55
Yeah, for sure. I mean, it's a little bit top down and grassroots is what's happening for us. So if, if I can get my, the CEO or a COO of an, of one of my divisions engaged with Gallup Strengths, going -- themselves going through the 34 assessment, getting their report, getting some coaching, it sort of sells itself at that point. If they're at all open to their own development and growth, and many of our leaders are, they, it sells itself at that point. And, and they're the ones who then make the call about, Oh, gosh, yes, we have to do this, and let's roll it out. And let's let roll it out at these layers or the whole or -- that's really working for us from a top-down approach.

Mary Rose Wild 9:40
Similarly, though, we're not waiting. We don't want to just have a single approach to anything. We're allowing managers, unit managers, even supervisors, find the tool for themselves. And if they want to enroll in and use the assessments for their team of 8, their team of 35, that's great too, because they become ambassadors for the tool almost sideways in their organization. They're talking to their peers about it. They're talking about the wins that some, that they're getting from it. I heard from one of our unit managers that one of her colleagues came back to the tool 3 months after the initial coaching, because that person was having a challenge with a particular colleague, and she said, What am I bringing? What can I be doing better? How can I understand myself in this situation? And it proved itself to be a valuable resource for that particular person at that time.

Jim Collison 10:39
Have you found rolling it into any onboarding programs? Or have you guys created unique programs to kind of help with that adoption, even though you're kind of taking a, I'll say a laissez faire approach to it, allowing people to kind of come to it on their own?

Mary Rose Wild 10:54
Yeah, yeah, that's a great question. And we are. So a little bit more of a programmatic approach. We have a managerial program, which we call "Passport to Leadership." And we've replaced an older assessment with Gallup Strengths. So, you know, all of our emerging leaders, on a go-forward basis, will get introduced to Gallup Strengths through that, which we're excited about. Additionally, as an organization, again, as we evolve and refine our thinking about sort of what gets built in the center and what gets continued to be built and deployed out in the divisions, the series, one of those is a consistent onboarding program. And as we explore the creation of that, absolutely, Gallup Strengths is one of the pillars that we hope to bring forward, so that any and all associates who are joining Lockton -- whether they're joining us in New York City or in Maine or Omaha, Nebraska, they will be exposed to the same, you know, cultural elements and pillars of Lockton, and one of those would be Gallup Strengths. So we're excited to be able to do that. And we hope to do so in the course of the next year.

Jim Collison 12:03
Wait a minute! You guys have an office here in Omaha, Nebraska?

Mary Rose Wild 12:05
Yeah, well, I found out just this week and, I was at a conference, and I found we have at least two associates. I don't know if that makes up an office, but --

Jim Collison 12:13
Office at home.

Mary Rose Wild 12:14
At least two folks.

Jim Collison 12:16
Work-at-home folks, yeah, here in Omaha. Oh, well, good. As you think about embedding this into your educational programs, what kind of lift do you think -- you know, they've been using some, some programs before, but you think about adding CliftonStrengths into that. How does that help you? And how does that help the organization in the lift for education?

Mary Rose Wild 12:37
Yeah, I mean, I, there's just so much power in CliftonStrengths. And I'll probably answer that question slightly a different way, which is sort of like how, in what way are we being deliberate and thoughtful about how and when we embed CliftonStrengths into some of our programmatic, programmatic elements? So they're introduced to it initially on onboarding. And then they come across it one more time, say, 5 years later, in Passport to Leadership. And then maybe further, even further down the road, in our flagship LEAD program, you know, how, what refinements do we introduce? What different layers of CliftonStrengths and leading with, with strengths do we introduce? That's the sort of, kind of question that we're thinking about as, as we want to make experience unique, but also scaffold it, so that at each exposure, our associates are gaining something different or seeing a different layer about how they can lever strengths or lead with strengths or guide, develop others with strengths, etc.

Measuring Progress Made

Jim Collison 13:39
What kind of, what kind of measurements, or how do you guys know you're making progress? This is a question we get a lot. It feels good to roll these things out. People do self-discovery, we get some team lift. Have you guys made decisions on thinking about those metrics? Or what are you watching to know that you're growing?

Mary Rose Wild 13:58
Yeah. No, that's a really great question, because it's the qualitative and the quantitative that matters. And I'm going to be honest: Early, here we are early, it's still relatively, in our journey. And I don't know if I'm going to put any particular quantitative measure on Gallup itself. However, what I am sort of measuring, and this maybe begins to straddle a line, is the pull-through of Gallup Strengths. So, for example, in performance management, again, each one of our divisions are very unique, each one series, so their performance management process systems and year-end questions, for example, vary. One of our series is already thinking about, Well, how do we turn these year-end performance review questions into strengths-based questions?

Mary Rose Wild 14:43
So one of the things that we hope to see, you know, 3 years down the line is we look back and we look at, we see pull-through -- not just in programmatic elements but just sort of the systemic HR practices of the organization. That's one of the things that's really important. Quantitatively, what's valuable to us right now, I just worked with my, my counterparts and account team at Gallup, and now that we have several hundred associates going, have gone through their CliftonStrengths, we are able to ascertain, at an organization level, what are our Top 10? What are our Bottom 5? That kind of data is actually really insightful to a leadership team. Because at this day and age, particularly with the war for talent, and so much focus on attracting, retaining, developing and engaging our associates, they, this insight about the composite of our organization who we're made up with, who we're made up with, our DNA, etc., is really insightful knowledge to bring to them. So from a quantitative perspective, that's some early data that we're sharing with the executives.

Jim Collison 15:50
When you think about the grassroots, you talked a little bit about earlier, grassroots movement. And I'm assuming, as part of, you know, building a strengths-based culture, we recommend you build strengths champions. How is that, are you seeing that happen, where individuals -- not necessarily trained coaches, but -- get excited about this framework, they kind of take it on naturally? Are you seeing what happened inside the organization? What's that kind of look like?

Mary Rose Wild 16:14
Yeah, it does happen. It has happened. I will tell you, this is not quantitatively measured in any way. But some of my best leaders, I would say, are the ones who are naturally inclined to develop their people, think about how to develop their teams, make them stronger, they're sort of, their language they'll say is "I'm pouring myself into my team." You know, they're the ones who what, the minute they hear of Gallup Strengths, they're like, "Do it. Sign me up. I want -- my entire team, 35 people, when can you do it?" And so those are my early champions, those are my early adopters, and, and I like working with them, just because of the positivity and energy that they bring to it in that. And they're the ones who not only go through it once, but they, I know that they're reinforcing it through team meetings after the session. They're reinforcing it. They're talking about it. They're leveraging it. And then hopefully, there'll be, they're able to influence others, other managers, other, other unit leaders along the way. So it's, it's exciting to see, yeah, who the early adopters and champions are in our business.

Jim Collison 17:23
Yeah, they're, they get so excited about it. And when you can turn them loose, that natural energy, right, that they bring, the natural enthusiasm to it, the, they'll, they'll do it after hours, they'll, right?

Mary Rose Wild 17:36
They'll do it after hours. I was just at a conference, one of our internal conferences, we had 300 colleagues and associates, all from different locations, and they talk about it over drinks, right? So, so they're, they're advocating for, and there's they're saying things like, "You got to try this! You got to do this! It totally worked for my team, and it helped so much!" you know. So it's great to see.

Goals for the Immediate Future

Jim Collison 17:57
I think in those settings, you know it's working in those work-group settings, where they're not required to talk about it. But you'll hear somebody go, "Tell me your Top 5 again?" you know, in a conversation, because they're trying to figure the person out, you know, or what's coming out through what they're saying. And I think that's some good indication. Thinking about good indications, as we think about the rest of the year and maybe into a little bit next, any goals about -- certainly you're not all the way, probably, as you look at this and building a strengths-based organization. What's next for you? What would you like to see coming up in the next 12 months or so, do you think? What's on the horizon there?

Mary Rose Wild 18:35
Yeah, I think, I'm going to go back to what I said before about pull-through -- like that is a big focus. And we know that's not easily done; it's easier said than done, because of just sort of the continued socialization change management, that that sort of requires, for both my team in the center as well as all of our colleagues out in the different series. So as, we really want to embed it into the programmatic elements like onboarding, like Passport to Leadership that I've mentioned. We really want to start thinking about pulling it through with our HR, HR processes, like, for example, talent reviews and performance management, just start, start to begin to embed the language in the organization deeper.

Mary Rose Wild 19:24
You know, one of the things about CliftonStrengths that I love is it's not just about the 34 strengths and, you know, the assessment, but it's that, it's that full mindset shift, and mindset shifts take time. And so we're patient with that. We understand, you know, the change that's going to be needed over not just one year but over the next multiple years for us to get there as an organization. But, you know, early indicators, it seems to resonate with our, with our folks, and particularly the millennials. We found out our millennial gen -- again, that data from, from Gallup Organization that they were able to give me insights to our, my, my particular organization, they informed me that Lockton's millennials have high Positivity in their Top 5. So the, just, that just parallels that, that, it ties right into this notion of being strengths-based, as opposed to weakness-fixing organization. So, yeah, we're excited to do more with it as we go forward.

Jim Collison 20:26
You have a lot, because you're allowing the teams to kind of self-direct in a lot of ways, organization to move as they, as they deem necessary. Have you found a, any, any set of tools or any set of resources that we make available to you working well or better than others? Or is each team picking a different path to get to the same place? Do you get a sense of that at all?

Mary Rose Wild 20:51
Yeah, yeah. Great question. A lot of Lockton's work and the, and a lot of, sort of, I'll call it the construction of our business units, series, divisions and, and groups is around team-based work. So much -- so I'll just, just kind of double-click on that a little bit more to further explain. So our associates will align themselves with a team. So for example, they'll call themselves, I'm part of team Collison. I'm part of Team Wild. So that is, hopefully shares with you the affinity that they have to their team, as well as the loyalty that they have to their team. So team dynamics, team health -- really important for us. And the team blend of Gallup, that particular tool, that, that session that we lead, incredibly powerful, because they, they sort of just work in their team silos so much. And, and the interactivity, the connectivity, the transactions between individuals matters greatly. So team blends are really important for us right now.

Jim Collison 22:10
You just taught me a new phrase. I don't know, I never picked up on this, but "I'm gonna double-click on that a little." Why have I never thought of that? I'm going to use that all the time. Such a great, it's such a great metaphor for where we, you know, where we've come in the work process. So you're talking about teams. Are you seeing any cross-team collaboration, where the framework, where the, the lexicon, knowing those things is helping at all? Are you hearing any stories where that's helping in cross-team collaboration?

Mary Rose Wild 22:42
Yeah, definitely. I mean, it's a little bit slower as we -- most of our cross-functional work happens with our associates in the center. So, so our center, 500, 600 associates, center-based associates are the ones who really work cross-functionally with each other. IT talking to Legal; Legal talking with their Compliance; Compliance talking with HR, all that. So as we get the language out there, we see it happening more and more, where folks are saying, you know, what are your Top 5? What's, what are yours? And trying to understand each other a little bit more. One of the things that we've done, too, is added -- and I know this is, this is not new to Gallup at all, but it's new for Lockton, who's 14 months into the journey -- but just to even add our Top 5 into our signature lines. You know, what are your Top 5? Here are mine. And just to have that -- that itself is a little bit, is significant in the symbolism, in terms of adoption for the organization.

Advice on Embedding CliftonStrengths Into an Org's Culture

Jim Collison 23:43
People start spying on other people's Top 5. How am I going to work with you most effective? Or -- what a great way, I think we've even done this at Gallup, where we started meetings, you know, we've got this idea of a Focus on You. So if we're having a meeting, and a lot of the folks don't know each other, maybe spending those first 5 or 10 minutes or so talking about who we are and what we do, and so, always, always great to see. We'll have a lot of professionals, HR professionals, organizations who are thinking about this, strengths champions inside of organizations, our independent coaches, listening to this. What would be your advice for them? If, what did you learn? Now, you've done this a couple of times, but each instance of it I'm sure has been a little bit different. And so if we think about those 14 months at Lockton, what kind of advice would you give someone who's starting to think about this? What would you, what advice would you give?

Mary Rose Wild 24:36
Yeah, that's a great question. I think I would say three things. One is, is lean in, and then patience and persistence. And I think that the two latter bits come hand in hand. So one, the patience is about listening to the organization -- or your client, if you're independent -- and really just trying to understand the org structure, the org dynamics, the politics, even the power dynamics of the company; just really seeing where the opportunities may be. But I also think that success is a change agent, and introducing Gallup Strengths is about persistence in doing so.

Mary Rose Wild 25:21
So, you know, I think the first "No" is just a "No, not now," where, and so it leaves the door open for maybe coming back 3 months later or 6 months later to reengage in the conversation or open, open it up once more and see if the, the mindset has shifted, if the thought patterns have changed, if there's more willingness now than there was, you know, 6 months ago. So I think that's what I would say is lean into those opportunities, and then, then have patience and persistence.

Jim Collison 25:52
I like that: patience and persistence, right, continually moving forward. Let me, let me drill down a little bit on that, as we think about the advice you give your new managers. So when a team is coming to this for the first time, and they've decided to move into this, the manager plays a huge role in the success of this rollout. And hopefully, they're supportive of it. I'm sure they are, if they're asking for it. What kind of advice are you giving them now that maybe you either didn't give them early on, or what have you learned about Lockton, and the advice to managers?

Mary Rose Wild 26:24
Yeah, yeah. And this is probably true of many who are in a managerial seat, which is, there's insight awareness that happens -- powerful, like, information coming into them through CliftonStrengths. All managers, at least all the ones in Lockton that I've run into, then go, "So now what? What do I do?" Right? So, so 2 hours of insight, 2 hours of self-awareness, 2 hours of awareness of who I am, who they are, all this, but they always say, "So now what do I do?" So I, I've learned to give them homework is what I, is what I've done. And I give them just something, here's what you do over the course of the next 5 months. Strengths is so new to you guys, it's going to take you more than just these 2 hours to even begin to peel back all the layers of your Top 5.

Mary Rose Wild 27:21
So just, for example, I might give them, Here's your homework: One strength every month for the next 5 months. Focus in on it, dedicate some team time to it, your next team meeting or at least a carve out a little portion of your team meetings to be talking about it. That's enough to get you continuing to use the language of strength, getting comfortable with it, beginning to make it your own and living in it. So homework is what I give the managers.

Jim Collison 27:50
Are they doing it? Do you --

Mary Rose Wild 27:52
They do. They, yeah, they, they'll, I mean, I won't hear from everybody, but it's nice to know, I think one represents many -- just like good feedback, bad feedback, that kind of thing. Right? So, so when I hear from one back, I go, OK, then it's probably working; that homework assignment is getting carried, carried out.

Jim Collison 28:09
Yeah, I always say one, one bit of good feedback represents 100; one bit of bad feedback just represents that person. That's the only way --

Mary Rose Wild 28:17
That's probably right. That's, that's, that sounds correct.

Keeping the Initiative Moving Forward

Jim Collison 28:19
It's the only way I can handle it. So as we think about, last question for me, as we think about long-term and, and keeping this strengths-based approach going, because I think that's what, a lot of people find that the most difficult. They, they'll do kind of a one-and-done and they lose some momentum. As you think about organizationalwide and what you hope for -- and maybe this will be a hope, more of a hope question than an implementation question -- what do you think you want to do in the next year to kind of keep that momentum going? What's on the forefront of your mind as far as being able to keep pushing the initiative forward?

Mary Rose Wild 28:56
Yeah, yep. Well, we started in November with the CliftonStrengths Discovery and putting about 25 of our HR TA and TD leaders through that. And then we just completed -- a handful of them and a few others -- completed CliftonStrengths, the beginning of the certification program. So it was a 4-day virtual training for them to begin to deepen their knowledge around coaching, around strengths. Many of them would like to continue the path forward to get fully certified.

Mary Rose Wild 29:35
So they have a window of time, over the course of the next 6 months, I believe, to pass a test, and it's different now than it was 15 years ago. I think it's, I don't know if it's easier now or, but it's different. There's a test, there's a test and some coaching that needs to be done. So, so, you know, that, that they've come out of now 4 days of training and, and that being heavy -- some, some of it, you know, because it's, it's a lot to learn, but they're still fully engaged. And they're, and they want to pursue full certification; that's a great indication to us that we're going to have the ambassadors in the organization, the capability in the organization to continue the implementation of strengths going forward. Because we need that. We can't just be, you know, 3 coaches in the center; we really need our divisions engaged. So --

Jim Collison 30:26
That's great, exciting to hear. Mary Rose, anything that I might have missed that or that you want to pass along to the, to the strengths community at large, based on your rollout or your implementation? I don't pretend to know everything. So anything that I might have missed that you'd want to share?

Mary Rose Wild 30:44
You covered so much. You know, I think I would just say there's, there's a lot of change work involved in build, and I know many of you are independent coaches, many of the HR leaders and TD leaders on this call are listening in probably recognize that -- that, that it parallels a lot of the change work that we do to continue to build and strengthen our organizations from the inside out. So, you know, I guess, follow the path, patience and persistence. You'll find lots of successes, and just build on those successes, one at a time. Yeah. So that would be my last thought on it.

Jim Collison 31:27
Appreciate that. We do have some questions from the chat room that I'd like to get to. So Marina asks, How far ahead do you usually plan the development programs and plans for your organization?

Mary Rose Wild 31:39
Great question. So we probably -- I will say, our programs are at this point built and almost on rinse-and-repeat mode. So, so there are long-standing programs that don't need any further, like, refinement or overhaul. Once they're in that state, we plan things about a calendar year in advance. So, so, for example, for this, our, our fiscal year, by the way, is different than the, in the true calendar year. So, so our fiscal year just started this month, May 1. So for this fiscal calendar year, if you will, you know, the planning was started in November, the calendar was really set, in terms of what we would do fiscal year '22-'23 is how we call our fiscal year, so about a year in advance.

Jim Collison 32:32
Do you enjoy the planning process? Is that something you like doing as part of what you do?

Mary Rose Wild 32:36
Yeah, we do -- I love doing that, you know, it's part of, it's a little bit puzzle-making and happening, and we need to, we, there's a lot of things like logistics and very pragmatic tactical things of, you know, classroom space now that we're coming off of COVID and everyone's returning back to work and, and really clamoring for in-person sessions, again. That reintroduces all the, you know, brings us back to all the logistical constraints and, and considerations we had to do. In which city? And do we have an office there? And how big is that office? You know, all of that has to happen. So both strategy and tactics come into play with planning.

Using the All 34 Report vs. Top 5

Jim Collison 33:14
Too bad we can't post our corporate planning like the Wordle that we post on, right, out there, just to show how much work we've put into this, right. So Ken asks the question, do you use the, the All 34 report or just Top 5? And then are you taking advantage of the new Manager report at all -- the new, meaning new from last year?

Mary Rose Wild 33:33
Yep. Do I use All 34 or just the Top 5? I use the Full 34 -- the Full 34 is super powerful as a coach. Can I coach on just the Top 5? I absolutely can. But I can probably go an inch deep with just the Top 5, versus when I have the Full 34 and I can see an individual's dominant talents, those being their Top 10, their Top 11, as well as their Bottom 5 that might indicate blind spots or watch-outs, I feel I can go a mile deep. So for me, I love the 34 report. And then I think there was a second part to that question -- How do you use the new Managers report? Ooh, the new Managers report is super powerful. If it's the same one that I'm thinking about, Jim, that's the one that had it's the 34 -- I think it's 25 to 32 pages, like it's that?

Jim Collison 34:25
It's Top 10, but it's 20 -- I think it's 20-some pages, yeah.

Mary Rose Wild 34:29
20-some pages -- yeah, that is extremely, if it's the same one that I'm thinking about that has the, the Gallup domains, and there's a particular page -- I believe it's page 22 --

Jim Collison 34:43
That's the All 34, it's the All 34, and it's page 21.

Mary Rose Wild 34:47
21, OK, there you go.

Jim Collison 34:50
It's good.

Mary Rose Wild 34:50
Yeah. That, that page is incredible. And as a coach, I flip to that page first with my coaching. So incredibly powerful.

Jim Collison 35:00
From an organizational standpoint, when, when an org wants to go this way, do they get Top 5? Do they get All 34? Do they get an opportunity for either? How are you guys working that?

Mary Rose Wild 35:10
Oh, yeah, that's actually a great question. So even before my arrival at Lockton, we had leaders, associates, managers finding their way to Gallup Strengths one way or another. They might have picked up one of the books, and in the books has the code that gives them their Top 5. So across our organization, we found that there are little pockets of associates out there that already have their Top 5. What we are doing as an org, though, is we want to release to them their Full 34. And we can do that through our account team at Gallup. We just say, "Hey, Nicole Smith has her Top 5. Can we release her 34 to her, so she has her report?" So for us, our, our go-to is to, is to use the Full 34.

Jim Collison 36:02
Yeah, I like that idea, and I've watched a lot organizations do this, where it's Top 5 out the door. But as they show interest, as they get involved in it, as they see some things, and if they ask, right, if they just ask -- it's a great, it's a great opportunity to kind of, as a reward, as a, as a recognition tool for that, never held back but a great opportunity for them to engage at another level. Ken, I'm going to change this question a little bit so it won't be exactly as it is on the screen. But what results are you seeing? And I want to, I kind of want to think, you know, we make some big promises around team performance with CliftonStrengths -- those teams that are performing. We addressed this a little bit earlier in the program, when we, when we talked about that. But are you, do you guys see, are you seeing any performance-oriented, development-oriented in some other way, kind of around this?

Mary Rose Wild 36:58
I, it's too early, probably, for us to say. But the question is there; it's already being provoked and asked. So for example, our, our the sales side of Lockton is, we call it the Producer Group. That's just sort of like our sales organization. And there's some curiosity right now about the profile of the best, the profile of the most successful. And then too, same thing, teams: the profile and the makeup of the leaders who are the best, or those who are engaged with Gallup -- are, are they indeed delivering more, delivering different? Probably too early, you know, just 5 months now -- 14 months for me in my role but 5 months with Gallup. But I hope over the course of the next 1 or 2 years, we will have that kind of insight.

Jim Collison 37:47
Yeah, and you probably won't see any single set of strengths in those, because we know those strengths can work in any kind of role. But great to start asking some of the questions about some of those talents, right, that's making them more successful. Good timing: We have a new, brand new CliftonStrengths for Sales report that's coming out June 1 that we're excited about. And so hopefully you guys -- it's brand new, I mean, we're just starting to talk about it. So your sales teams this may be, you know, as you think about the future of what you're doing in your sales teams, that could be --

Mary Rose Wild 38:19
Absolutely! Yeah, count us in for something like that. We'd love to explore that. Yeah, yeah.

Jim Collison 38:24
Yeah. As you think about -- I'll ask, I'll, I'll kind of wrap it with this question, the magic wand. If you had a magic wand, and you could change anything organizationally, structurally around the speed of things, what, what do you, what would be a wish that you could kind of say, "Man, I'm really" -- or a hope, "I'm really hoping in the next 6 months, we would see this." What would that be?

Mary Rose Wild 38:49
So I love, I love converting the holdouts. So like in any, again, it's a change effort. And we experience it in any organization with any change that we're bring, we're bringing forward -- CliftonStrengths no different than any of the others. And there, there are resisters in our organization. We've talked a lot about ambassadors. We've talked a lot about champions, early adopters. But there are some that are holding out. So I hope that this time next year, we've begun to convert some of those into believers and into champions in the organization, because those leaders can bring a great tool, a great self-discovery, a great message to the teams below them by doing, by doing so -- by becoming champions on, around Gallup Strengths.

Jim Collison 39:41
In Spanish, we call Woo "carisma." That's the term we use, and I think you have enough charisma. You'll convince and influence. Even though you don't have Woo in your Top 5, I'm sure that you will have the influence to push those forward. Listen, nothing overcomes resistance like success. And so as you start to, as teams start to have success and people start saying, Hey, wait a minute. Like, I know I was against that, but I'm actually seeing this thing work. Maybe we ought to give this a try, you know, so, so congratulations. Well, thank you, Mary Rose, thank you for taking the time today to be a part of this conversation, appreciate it. Thanks for all the work that you've done over the last gazillion years that you've been involved with. But you're right. Like --

Mary Rose Wild 40:33
That makes me sound even older!

Jim Collison 40:36
Maybe just 3 years -- big mistake on my part. But thanks for all the work that you do. And thanks for coming on today. I appreciate it. Can you hang tight for me one second and I'll close this up.

Mary Rose Wild 40:46
Absolutely, yep.

Jim Collison 40:48
Hang tight. We'll remind everyone to take full advantage -- all the resources we talked about are available, many of them available in Gallup Access. Head out to For coaching, master coaching or if you want to become a Gallup-Certified Strengths Coach, or you're an organization that wants to engage us in, with us like Lockton has, you can send us an email: Super easy. We'll -- just give us some information and we'll get right back to you on that as well. You can find us on Facebook in our big Facebook group, if that's what you want to do:; or any other social platform just by searching "CliftonStrengths." We want to thank you for joining us -- for those who joined us live, thanks for doing that today. For everyone else listening to the podcast, there's probably another one. Just hit Play, and go on to the next one. There's some great encouragement for you. With that, we'll say, Goodbye, everybody.

Mary Rose Wild's Top 5 CliftonStrengths are Achiever, Focus, Activator, Futuristic and Relator.

Learn more about using CliftonStrengths to help yourself and others succeed:

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